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Post by Feralan on Apr 1, 2009 8:43:46 GMT 1
There are a few idle questions on my mind regarding Kaldorei life -- nothing big, just little things, and nothing that's covered by official sources (which are scarce anyway). Sooo I thought I'd post them here, once a month, to see if it'll amuse anyone to post their thoughts on the matter. I'll keep mine to myself for now.
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Post by Feralan on Apr 1, 2009 8:52:12 GMT 1
Monthly Musings #1: Summer/day and winter/night
Kaldorei are nocturnal, they revere the moon. They are also very close to nature. Now, the coming of spring and summer is usually celebrated as the return of life and better times. Lengthening days are a big part of that of course. Conversely, winter with shorter days and lack of the sun's warmth is a time of hardship and life lying dormant or struggling.
When the Kaldorei celebrate the changing seasons, is the joy at life's renewed strength mixed with a certain regret that the comfortable, moonlit nights get shorter? Is Elune seen as "weaker" or "more distant" in summer, although the world she guards florishes at that time? Are the nights longer during the winter because a dormant, struggling world "needs her gaze more"?
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Lana
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Post by Lana on Apr 1, 2009 15:36:30 GMT 1
Good idea this, Feratron =)
I had originally written a pretty long text about the origin of religion and how solar and lunar dieties played a roll in modern times, when I suddenly noticed something you wrote: "winter with shorter days and lack of the sun's warmth..." and I came to wonder: isn't it only in the north of Europe (Germany, France, British isles and Scandinavia) that we had this concept? I am pretty sure that the Greeks and Romans, from whom the abrahamic religions took a lot from, only had the concept of winter = no harvest and summer = harvest. So that the Kaldorei would in fact not think about it like we do since the amount of sun/moonlight during summer/winter wasn't as different as it was up here.
EDIT: And with abrahamic relions thrown in there, I wanted to point out that Blizzard being American has a lot of religious flows worked in and the traditional Sun = Male and Moon = Female concept has endured in Christianity and WoW alike.
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Carindia
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Post by Carindia on Apr 14, 2009 17:31:34 GMT 1
I would imagine it would be a mixture of the two, with spring and the Kaldorei would celebrate the coming of more life, and while in their home territories there would develop a thick canopy of leaves from the trees (such as in ashenvale), which would filter the sun out and leave it more like late dusk beneath them. The winter on the other hand would bring longer nights, but the leaves of the trees would fall, leaving the days to be more bleak and bright.
I would imagine this would have the impact that the Kaldorei are more active during the summer, as there is more wildlife around and it is a comfortable temperature and light all day round. During the winter, I would think that they would become more nocturnal but also revere the return of the moon more, as it would also be more visible visible through the trees. This might leave the lunar festival as a celebration of when the world no longer needs Elune to watch over it so much, and so she 'withdraws'. The festival may be a large event, but I imagine it would not be as important to them then the other races, who rely on the day/night and summer/winter cycle a lot more for their way of life.
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Post by Miluiel on Apr 20, 2009 11:21:07 GMT 1
Perhaps when the time of summer comes it is not viewed that Elune's power has become "weaker", but as you said she becomes some what "distant" since she has touched that which flourishes around us and nurtured it through the winter months.
The point of view I would take is that summer she is distant due to her work being able to flourish and grow without the need of close guidance or her hand; conversly in the winter months that which she protects and keeps need her more as it dormant or struggles to remain.
I would say though from a priestly point of view that I would never think that Elunes' power wanes in the summer but is a constant through the cycle of the seasons.
I hope all this made some sense.
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Post by Feralan on May 7, 2009 11:27:47 GMT 1
Thanks for the replies. Yes, I'd agree with the suggestion that maybe the night elves think Elune can "withdraw" a bit during summer since life flourishes on its own then and does not need her as much as during the hard winter months. Next topic! Monthly Musings #2: Food! Kaldorei are a hunter-gatherer society. What does that mean for their dietary habits compared to our own? All sorts of meat and fish would be common of course, also wild nuts, vegetables, mushrooms, fruit and herbs. But what about two types of food that are so common and important for us: bread and dairy products? Would they even know these? Would they be a rare delicacy? Where would they come from? Kaldorei do not keep cows or goats or sheep after all, nor do they cultivate grain.
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Post by Miluiel on May 7, 2009 12:57:01 GMT 1
I have given this some thought... We do have a cheese called Darnassian Bleu and its orgins have to be from Darnassus; however I am not sure what type of animal would be used to create such a cheese (I did consider milking squirrels).
There are many other foodstuffs that appear in the Inn that also have unexplainable orgins (this comes from our online conversation).
Bread I think would be a delicacy since there is not a place where grain is cultivated unless there is a secret farmland in the forests with a granary.
Quite possibly there could be some trade agreements in place where the food is imported from, but that raises further questions as to why we would do such a thing... Perhaps some Kaldorei have acquired a taste for some of the outside cuisine (ie cooking profession) therefore it would still be possible for the food to be in our cities.
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Post by Silathin Starseeker on May 8, 2009 9:34:15 GMT 1
Bugger, I forgot my to write my own thoughts on Elune's coming and growing related to the season as I don't agree with the notion. Anyhoo, tough on me, next topic yes!
Bread can be made from other things than just grain, examples here of are cornbread or ricebread. Information on the dietary habits of the kaldorei are, so far as what I've dug up, limited at best, but I do not see things as bread not being in the diet. Just look at our own cultures each and one have all found various ways to grind something into flour, mix it with water and bake it up. The lack of ingame fields in kaldorei lands should not in itself exclude the possibility as they are, at best, simplified. Besides, maybe it is all grown wild in nature rather than the organised and squared out human thing? (fun thing to think of as that is part of what we talked about with Raleon in Stormwind, how to teach humans "proper" agriculture ^^)
Cheese and dairy products in general I am more doubtful of, part because of the lack of milk sources. I reckon the closest we would get would be boar, saber or deer and neither are very fit for milking being undomesticated and the two first fight back.
Then, I'd also like to mention the kimchi, and a few other foods, that you only find in kaldorei cities (Astranaar and perhaps Feathermoon? Can only remember Astranaar). Kimchi is made from cabbage but it being sold only exclusive in kaldorei lands does that mean noone else has cabbage or rice for rice cakes? I don't think so, it is likely just something fun they chose to make a kaldorei speciality.
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Post by Feralan on May 8, 2009 12:57:19 GMT 1
Just because the first month is over doesn't mean you can't share your thoughts on Elune and the seasonal cycles! I don't think bread and related products would be unknown, but compared to an agrarian society they'd likely be very rare -- far from "our daily bread", and more of a special delicacy. Harvesting wild grain when they can find any is something I can see the night elves do, but not "real" agriculture. Milk is a bigger problem, yes. 'Sabers are family, and probably wouldn't be impressed if you wanted to take the milk they need for their cubs from them. Maybe they'd let a Kaldorei baby or toddler drink a bit now and then, but that's it IMO. I'm actually toying with the idea of having Feralan be revolted at the notion of "stealing" the infants' sustenance from another being once you're weaned.
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Post by Silathin Starseeker on May 8, 2009 13:03:13 GMT 1
Seeing as how many options there are for making bread with other items than grain I don't think it would be rare or even unusual, but I agree that I do not see it being as big a part of kaldorei diet as fruit, berries, vegetables of other kinds and various meat types would be.
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Post by Feralan on Jun 15, 2009 10:48:59 GMT 1
A bit overdue this time.
Monthly Musings #3: Books
We have a species that is something books decidedly are not: exceedingly long-lived. Here on Earth, books from a couple hundred years ago are treasured antiques and handled with great care. But what are a few hundred years to a Kaldorei? People write something down for various reasons, one of them being the desire to preserve knowledge beyond the lifespan of the person discovering or holding that knowledge. For the night elves, that'd be quite hard; even stone carvings erode over the millennia.
So why do night elves write things down? Would most of their knowledge be passed on orally, given their longevity and tribal nature? How to they perserve their writings? Or do they just copy decaying books every few hundred years?
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Post by Silathin Starseeker on Jun 15, 2009 11:18:07 GMT 1
Because of kaldorei culture and its roots to which it is still very much tied to, I think a lot of legends and stories are mainly preserved orally.
But I think that teachings, especially those of Elune, and decidedly scholarly subjects are likely to be written down in some format. Quite simply because the exact wording is important here and memory is, as anyone will know, fallible. It is for us with our short lives, just think of how memory can warp, distort and forget details when spanning centuries or even millennia. A mind can only contain so much, even for those blessed/cursed with such longevity.
So legends and stories, things that would normally spread by mouth to mouth would likely not be written down as a whole as there is not a tradition for this. Teachings and deep theoretical works probably would though as to preserve this knowledge as unflawed as possible.
A side thought though.. I think that during the Age of Azhara and up until the Sundering, perhaps a lot more was written down there as she was leading a great big step away from everything traditionally kaldorei. Perhaps even a form of censorship for written things existed (exists?) after that to protect the kaldorei race from dangerous and "wrong" knowledge?
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Post by Miluiel on Jun 15, 2009 13:24:58 GMT 1
I agree with Silathin legends and other types of mythological stories are mainly passed on through oral histories passed on from generation to generation.
That would mean that sometimes details of events and other things are somewhat distorted from the original as it is said that history is written by the victors (meaning small things can be inflated in to epic tales of bravery and heroism).
However there are tales and lessons that cannot be properly told without the medium of the written word. Details, names, places and facts need to be remembered so that is why they are written about. Without these books generations of knowledge and wisdom are lost to the ages.
To keep these tales and lessons through the millennia I envisage that scribes and lore keepers are employed to ensure that the texts are not lost to the ravages of age. We may be a race with great longevity of life, but the world around us still ages and so with that so does the texts that we as a culture hold dear.
In thinking though that these texts are pure, perhaps it is a bit naive of me to think that they will appear in their original forms as we know that things can be embellished and perhaps that happens as well with the written text to keep it alive and fresh for the next generation.
So my answer is mixed histories are both preserved orally and in the written word… of course that is for the Kaldorei others may have different traditions.
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Post by Silathin Starseeker on Jun 15, 2009 13:55:14 GMT 1
The library at Dire Maul suddenly sprang to my mind
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Carindia
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Post by Carindia on Jun 20, 2009 10:36:41 GMT 1
They might well have some diffrent form of paper, or it being protected in some way by the various Kaldorei powers, as I can't imagine the books in their normal locations lasting long to the elements, as they tend to be very exposed.
Considering the number of bookshelves that do seem to float around Kaldorei houses, I'd imagine they would have the teachings of important people written down. Them might also write down things you would be likely to forget or find very hard to memorise, such as maps of rarely visited territories, or the exact schematics of buildings/houses ect.
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